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as soon as President Bush is gone.. - 11/12/2008 5:38:11 PM
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Leslie_JnJs_mom
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Do you think we will once again be under the gun of our enemies? Do you think we will suffer another attack because he would be gone? What do you think the next president would do about it?
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<------- Jessica and I had so much fun with grandma!
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RE: as soon as President Bush is gone.. - 11/12/2008 5:41:10 PM
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EStan
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Joe Biden certainly seems to think so.
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Eternal Father, grant that through the tears of repentance I may see more clearly the brightness and glories of the saving cross.
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RE: as soon as President Bush is gone.. - 11/12/2008 9:41:25 PM
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leonfigg3
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Anyone who has paid attention to recent events, IMO knows very well that a number of bad people and heads-of-state have been waiting for a change of administration in the United States.
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RE: as soon as President Bush is gone.. - 11/12/2008 9:43:21 PM
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Rockwall
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I believe we will, just how big I don't know. The World Trade Center bombing was done within a month of Clinton's presidency and the Twin Towers fell several months after Bush's presidency. Biden said the virgin-birthed Obama will have an internatinal crisis within the first 6 months so I am not the only one who believes Obama will be tested.
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Power tends to corrupt, and absolute power corrupts absolutely
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RE: as soon as President Bush is gone.. - 11/12/2008 10:13:36 PM
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Wild-Rose
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quote:
What do you think the next president would do about it?
Perhaps the terrorists will be invited to the White House for a tea party to discuss matters.
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Wild-Rose
Rejoice that your name is written in heaven. Luke 10:20
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RE: as soon as President Bush is gone.. - 11/12/2008 10:23:50 PM
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ManimalX
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I don't know... on one hand, the Muslim terrorists could see Obama's lack of spine as an opportunity to "bring it to" the Great White Satan. On the other hand, they may see his lack of spine as an opportunity to act with impunity in the rest of the world since Obama will not be likely to do anything about it.
After 8 years of a strong President who has made sure the battles take place on enemy soil instead of home soil, it will be hard to adjust to the Office being occupied by a sissy appeaser.
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"But the day of the Lord will come like a thief, and then the heavens will pass away with a roar, and the heavenly bodies will be burned up and dissolved, and the earth and the works that are done on it will be exposed." - 2nd Peter 3:10
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RE: as soon as President Bush is gone.. - 11/12/2008 10:55:44 PM
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John_O
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Leslie_JnJs_mom
Do you think we will once again be under the gun of our enemies? Do you think we will suffer another attack because he would be gone? What do you think the next president would do about it?
We'll suffer an attack on our soil almost instantly. obama will wet himself and try to appease the terrorists. We either need to buy guns and lots of ammo today (BLOAT) or start studying arabic. Carter was terrified by a rabbit, I expect even worse from obama.
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Psalms 46:10 Be still, and know that I am God: I will be exalted among the heathen, I will be exalted in the earth.
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RE: as soon as President Bush is gone.. - 11/12/2008 11:00:40 PM
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Leslie_JnJs_mom
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quote:
ORIGINAL: ManimalX
I don't know... on one hand, the Muslim terrorists could see Obama's lack of spine as an opportunity to "bring it to" the Great White Satan. On the other hand, they may see his lack of spine as an opportunity to act with impunity in the rest of the world since Obama will not be likely to do anything about it.
After 8 years of a strong President who has made sure the battles take place on enemy soil instead of home soil, it will be hard to adjust to the Office being occupied by a sissy appeaser.
Oy I know what you mean. I really think that once we have a chance to look back we will see that for every plot we knew about that was stopped there were many others we did not hear about that were stopped in early planning. I think Obama is going to bow down to the extreme left that wants us to be friends with the terrorists and leave us open for more attacks. I do not think him being popular worldwide will protect us either since Clinton was popular around the world and look at all the attacks we had. Even 9/11 was mostly planned during his time. I hope I am wrong but I worry we are in for it.
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<------- Jessica and I had so much fun with grandma!
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RE: as soon as President Bush is gone.. - 11/12/2008 11:23:06 PM
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-J-
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They have been, and unfortunately succeeding abroad, I don't doubt that they have the US in their scopes. Hopefully they won't find success ANYWHERE.... The thing that really has me worried, is that Bush with his pseudo cowboy bravado has created more terrorists and hatred toward us, leaving us in a much more dangerous world.
I PRAY that they don't succeed.
-J-
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RE: as soon as President Bush is gone.. - 11/12/2008 11:58:19 PM
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iluvatar
Posts: 2030
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quote:
ORIGINAL: -J-
They have been, and unfortunately succeeding abroad, I don't doubt that they have the US in their scopes. Hopefully they won't find success ANYWHERE.... The thing that really has me worried, is that Bush with his pseudo cowboy bravado has created more terrorists and hatred toward us, leaving us in a much more dangerous world.
DING DING DING! We have a winner! Bob, tell our contestant what he's won!
Al Qaeda's ability to recruit people is based partly on hatred against the west, particularly the US. Obviously, much of their propaganda is based on lies and distortions, but through some hypocritical and selfish foreign policy actions, we've given them enough fuel to base their message of hate on at least some truths. Further displays of machismo and bravado stoke already angry sentiments against us; while they may offer some military advantage, they're generally inefficient against this sort of enemy and really only serve to placate domestic political interests.
What we need is a more deft, nuanced foreign policy that considers the intricacies and subtleties of foreign cultures and political situations instead of lumping them all together into some overly simplistic worldview that amounts to little more than saying "all them brown people look the same to me."
I hope that Obama can deliver this and if he does, I hope he explains to Americans what's really going on, in detail, rather than some meaningless populist nonsense akin to "you're either with us, or you're with the terrorists."
-Dan.
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Well, I've been to one world fair, a picnic, and a rodeo, and that's the stupidest thing I ever heard come over a set of earphones.
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RE: as soon as President Bush is gone.. - 11/13/2008 12:05:26 AM
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rlj
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If we are then it would seem to me that the GWoR has been a big, huge colossal waste of money, time and lives.
_____________________________
-Roger
I could wile away the hours
Conferrin' with the flowers
Consultin' with the rain
And my head I'd be scratchin'
While my thoughts were busy hatchin'
If I only had a brain
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RE: as soon as President Bush is gone.. - 11/13/2008 12:16:22 AM
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-J-
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quote:
ORIGINAL: iluvatar
quote:
ORIGINAL: -J-
They have been, and unfortunately succeeding abroad, I don't doubt that they have the US in their scopes. Hopefully they won't find success ANYWHERE.... The thing that really has me worried, is that Bush with his pseudo cowboy bravado has created more terrorists and hatred toward us, leaving us in a much more dangerous world.
DING DING DING! We have a winner! Bob, tell our contestant what he's won!
Al Qaeda's ability to recruit people is based partly on hatred against the west, particularly the US. Obviously, much of their propaganda is based on lies and distortions, but through some hypocritical and selfish foreign policy actions, we've given them enough fuel to base their message of hate on at least some truths. Further displays of machismo and bravado stoke already angry sentiments against us; while they may offer some military advantage, they're generally inefficient against this sort of enemy and really only serve to placate domestic political interests.
What we need is a more deft, nuanced foreign policy that considers the intricacies and subtleties of foreign cultures and political situations instead of lumping them all together into some overly simplistic worldview that amounts to little more than saying "all them brown people look the same to me."
I hope that Obama can deliver this and if he does, I hope he explains to Americans what's really going on, in detail, rather than some meaningless populist nonsense akin to "you're either with us, or you're with the terrorists."
-Dan.
I apologize Bob, but I must concede my winnings to Iluvatar.
I wish I could have said it as well as you just did Dan. I also hope Obama and his Cabinet can deliver.
Peace,
-J-
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RE: as soon as President Bush is gone.. - 11/13/2008 12:31:52 AM
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-J-
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quote:
If we are then it would seem to me that the GWoR has been a big, huge colossal waste of money, time and lives.
What on good earth is a GWoR?
Thanks,
-J-
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RE: as soon as President Bush is gone.. - 11/13/2008 12:50:11 AM
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leonfigg3
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Deliver what?
Deliver us into the hands of our enemies in order to keep the peace at any price?
What exactly is a "more deft, nuanced foreign policy that considers the intricacies and subtleties of foreign cultures and political situations"?
How far do we have to bend over and be understanding of people who want to kill or enslave people that do not believe as they do?
How long do we have to wait for a head-of-state to do what he has aggreed to and prove he is not guilty of things we accuse him of?
Prove he is not dangerous to his people. the region, or the world?
I keep remembering a plea Halle Selasi, the Emperor of Ethiopia, voiced at the United Nations as his country was being threatened with invasion by Italy before the war in Europe became World War II. He begged for help from the UN saying that "It is us today. It will be you tomorrow."
Sooner or later someone, some country, has to do what has to be done no matter how distasteful. Right now, there is practically no other country, or international community organization, that is will and able as the United States to do that. When we stop be willing to do that which HAS to be done, that is when this world will be on a downward spiral that it will never be able to recover from, no matter how understanding we try to be.
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RE: as soon as President Bush is gone.. - 11/13/2008 1:21:59 AM
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-J-
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quote:
Deliver what?
Deliver us into the hands of our enemies in order to keep the peace at any price?
Bush has already delivered this. I'm hoping he starts to clean up this mess, which will take longer then 4 years.
quote:
What exactly is a "more deft, nuanced foreign policy that considers the intricacies and subtleties of foreign cultures and political situations"?
To me it would not be using sophomoric, and dangerous taunts such as "Bring 'em On!" (which Bush himself agreed was a mistake) As well as diving into unnecessary conflicts and wars. I see nothing wrong with talking first.
quote:
How far do we have to bend over and be understanding of people who want to kill or enslave people that do not believe as they do?
What's wrong with understanding?
quote:
Sooner or later someone, some country, has to do what has to be done no matter how distasteful. Right now, there is practically no other country, or international community organization, that is will and able as the United States to do that. When we stop be willing to do that which HAS to be done, that is when this world will be on a downward spiral that it will never be able to recover from, no matter how understanding we try to be.
It seems you feel violence is the only answer, and in some cases it is. BUT treating a threat diplomatically rather then violently would be the better choice.
Peace,
-J-
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RE: as soon as President Bush is gone.. - 11/13/2008 3:26:21 AM
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Zhi
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Huh.
Out of curiosity, do you think that the US "acting nice" will really cause groups like Al Qaeda to stop hating us? I personally have kind of gotten the impression, mostly from their own interviews and material, that the only thing that will cause them to NOT hate us is us all converting to Islam. And at that, it would have to be the *right kind* of Islam.
I for one am not willing to stop being an "infidel".
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The optimist says the glass is half full. The pessimist says the glass is half empty. The engineer says the glass is twice as large as it needs to be.
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RE: as soon as President Bush is gone.. - 11/13/2008 4:08:01 AM
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_jjp_
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quote:
ORIGINAL: -J-
I see nothing wrong with talking first.
Talking to who? Bin Laden? The Taliban? People who say that Bush's foreign policy has a narrow view then advocate us talking to people whose only thoughts of the US is to kill or convert show that they have even less of an understanding of the real world than Bush does.
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RE: as soon as President Bush is gone.. - 11/13/2008 8:19:54 AM
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-J-
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Zhi
quote:
ORIGINAL: -J-
I see nothing wrong with talking first.
Out of curiosity, do you think that the US "acting nice" will really cause groups like Al Qaeda to stop hating us? I personally have kind of gotten the impression, mostly from their own interviews and material, that the only thing that will cause them to NOT hate us is us all converting to Islam. And at that, it would have to be the *right kind* of Islam.
I for one am not willing to stop being an "infidel".
No, I simply stated that violence isn't always the answer, yet in some cases, sadly it's unavoidable.
quote:
ORIGINAL: _jjp_
quote:
ORIGINAL: -J-
I see nothing wrong with talking first.
Talking to who? Bin Laden? The Taliban? People who say that Bush's foreign policy has a narrow view then advocate us talking to people whose only thoughts of the US is to kill or convert show that they have even less of an understanding of the real world than Bush does.
No, maybe I wasn't clear enough in my post. What I was trying to convey is that Bush and friends took their eye off the ball in Afghanistan, and pretty much turned Iraq into a terrorist factory, and I'm pretty sure President Elect Obama won't be as irresponsible.
Since this isn't thread about the Iraq war, or Bush maybe we should continue this portion of the discussion in one if the ever so handy One Stop Threads, and stick with answering the OP.
Peace,
-J-
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RE: as soon as President Bush is gone.. - 11/13/2008 8:35:28 AM
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SonInMe1
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The reason why Russia dealt with Nixon was because they thought he was a nut.
Teddy said walk softly but carry a big stick.
Terrorists and tyrants do not listen to words and they take advantage of appeasers.
Bush did not create the hatred of the USA by terrorists..that is revisionist history. They have been attacking us long before 9/11. The hatred was there...it just took a man of courage, unlike Clinton who appeased the terrorists and Saddam, for 8 years.
Give me a Teddy or a Ronnie or a W over Obama and the left anyday.
I think the russins had it right. They were attacked once by terrorists. They not only killed the terrorists..they killed their families too.
You want some? Come get some. Mess with the USA? Watch out. Bomb us...be prepared. Bin Laden found out. We are the international nice guys mostly and they think we are soft....Bush said, no. A man of courage in a time we needed it.
_____________________________
You adulterous people, don't you know that friendship with the world is hatred toward God? Anyone who chooses to be a friend of the world becomes an enemy of God.
James 4:4
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RE: as soon as President Bush is gone.. - 11/13/2008 8:47:09 AM
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Born_Again
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quote:
ORIGINAL: SonInMe1
You want some? Come get some. Mess with the USA? Watch out. Bomb us...be prepared. Bin Laden found out. We are the international nice guys mostly and they think we are soft....Bush said, no. A man of courage in a time we needed it.
You must have missed the interview of President Bush yesterday. In the interview he said “ one of my mistake is saying “ bring it on, we have enough troop to defend us , bring it and we will fight”
By the way , Bin Ladin found out that he can kill 3000 Americans and get away with it and Americans are so stupid that instate of going after him we would go after someone who had nothing to do with 9/11. You are right president bush is very courageous, instate of going after the guy who ordered killing of 3000 Americans, President went after the guy who had nothing to do with it. You got a have guts to do that.
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RE: as soon as President Bush is gone.. - 11/13/2008 8:50:14 AM
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iluvatar
Posts: 2030
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quote:
ORIGINAL: leonfigg3
What exactly is a "more deft, nuanced foreign policy that considers the intricacies and subtleties of foreign cultures and political situations"?
How far do we have to bend over and be understanding of people who want to kill or enslave people that do not believe as they do?
Well, it would help to understand why they want to kill us, wouldn't it? It's not because "they hate our freedom and liberty." I'm not talking about coddling them; I'm talking about understanding what makes them tick so we can more effectively deal with them and any other situations that might fuel such resentment.
It would also be good to keep in mind how much economic reform helps to modernize and change a country's culture; it may be a more effective long-term strategy to pay more attention to a nation's economy, helping it grow and giving its citizens something to focus on other than how much they hate us. I wonder where Cuba would be today w/o the sanctions.
quote:
ORIGINAL: SonInMe1
Bush did not create the hatred of the USA by terrorists..that is revisionist history. They have been attacking us long before 9/11. The hatred was there...
You're right, it was there. Some of our problems go back to the end of WW2. In our glorious fight against communism, we meddled in a lot of places, made messes of a lot of things and supported leaders who never should have been supported. We won, but at a cost.
-Dan.
_____________________________
Well, I've been to one world fair, a picnic, and a rodeo, and that's the stupidest thing I ever heard come over a set of earphones.
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RE: as soon as President Bush is gone.. - 11/13/2008 9:05:46 AM
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-J-
Posts: 63
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quote:
I think the russins had it right. They were attacked once by terrorists. They not only killed the terrorists..they killed their families too
Kill their families too? Are you serious?
quote:
You want some? Come get some. Mess with the USA? Watch out.
This is exactly the kind of taunting that we don't need. Bush acknowledged a day or two ago that he was in the wrong for using such irresponsible taunts in his speeches (and I commend him for his honesty, even if it did take him 5 years)
-J-
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RE: as soon as President Bush is gone.. - 11/13/2008 9:15:26 AM
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Jhud
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It appears that once Bush is out of office Congress will focus on the important matter of investigating the Bush administration:
But even if his administration rejects the calls for investigations, Mr. Obama cannot control what the courts or Congress do. Several lawsuits are seeking information about Bush policies, including an Islamic charity’s claim that it was illegally spied on by Mr. Bush’s program on wiretapping without warrants.
And Congressional Democrats say that they are determined to pursue their investigations — and that they expect career officials to disclose other issues after the Bush administration leaves. “We could spend the entire next four years investigating the Bush years,” Mr. Whitehouse said.
It's good to know that in what may be one of the most critical times in American history, a crisis requiring the full cooperation of the entire government, that the Democratic congress is focused on revenge against it's political enemies.
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Jack
I believe in Christianity as I believe that the sun has risen: not only because I see it, but because by it I see everything else.
- C.S. Lewis
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RE: as soon as President Bush is gone.. - 11/13/2008 9:17:45 AM
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StephK
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I have a feeling it is going to get ugly.
_____________________________
Stephanie
The heart of the wise inclines to the right but the heart of the fool to the left.
Even as he walks along the road, the fool lacks sense and shows everyone how stupid he is. ~ Ecc. 10:2-3
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RE: as soon as President Bush is gone.. - 11/13/2008 9:19:52 AM
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stamper_ben
Posts: 10366
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From: Lone Star State
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Jhud
It appears that once Bush is out of office Congress will focus on the important matter of investigating the Bush administration:
But even if his administration rejects the calls for investigations, Mr. Obama cannot control what the courts or Congress do. Several lawsuits are seeking information about Bush policies, including an Islamic charity’s claim that it was illegally spied on by Mr. Bush’s program on wiretapping without warrants.
And Congressional Democrats say that they are determined to pursue their investigations — and that they expect career officials to disclose other issues after the Bush administration leaves. “We could spend the entire next four years investigating the Bush years,” Mr. Whitehouse said.
It's good to know that in what may be one of the most critical times in American history, a crisis requiring the full cooperation of the entire government, that the Democratic congress is focused on revenge against it's political enemies.
And if that doesn't bring about the anticipated results they can always re-open the steroid use in sports again.
_____________________________
We will be known as His by the love we show one another.
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