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RE: War in Afghanistan - 10/10/2009 4:58:47 PM
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rlj
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quote:
ORIGINAL: tsnody2001
Where did the "Aimless War?" thread go?
Probably got deleted since it was almost a year old and this one is current.
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This is our new kitty and we have a new cat who must be so fat I can't crop a picture of him to fit my CW Avatar. His name is Tom Riddle. This little guy here I found in the yard in May, this is Cosmo.
--Roger--
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RE: War in Afghanistan - 10/10/2009 6:21:54 PM
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tsnody2001
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No, the one I'm talking about had less than 20 posts on it and just popped up in the last few days. But now it is gone. Oh well.
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During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act. ~George Orwell
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RE: War in Afghanistan - 10/11/2009 3:50:30 AM
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rlj
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In other news, not content to kill by electrocution American troops in Iraq through their shoddy work, a certain ethnic American contractor who got paid over $4 million in bonus' per American killed in Iraq has continued their work in Afghanistan:
quote:
"In general, the electrical power systems in the camp can be described as a disaster waiting to happen," electrician Noris Rogers wrote to his bosses at military contractor KBR about conditions at one base in 2005. The letter warned of "extreme dangers" of electrical shock and fire hazards at the facility.
Rogers, who left Afghanistan shortly after writing that letter, told CNN that the work done by KBR at one U.S. base in Kabul was "by far" the worst he has seen in 20-plus years in the trade.
"As a complete whole, the electrical work at the camp was very dangerous," he said. "And I don't think it would be an exaggeration to say that I don't believe any of it was done safely."
Read about how KBR competently keeps our troops safe with their work
< Message edited by rlj -- 10/11/2009 2:05:20 PM >
_____________________________
This is our new kitty and we have a new cat who must be so fat I can't crop a picture of him to fit my CW Avatar. His name is Tom Riddle. This little guy here I found in the yard in May, this is Cosmo.
--Roger--
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RE: War in Afghanistan - 10/12/2009 4:35:55 PM
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rlj
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quote:
The M4 is a shorter, lighter version of the M16, which made its debut during the Vietnam war. Roughly 500,000 M4s are in service, making it the rifle troops on the front lines trust with their lives.
Sen. Tom Coburn, R-Okla., a leading critic of the M4, said Thursday the Army needs to move quickly to acquire a combat rifle suited for the extreme conditions U.S. troops are fighting in.
I'm reading about this and I was wondering if it was low quality or just high maintenance piece of weaponry. It sounds from the article (though I don't know for sure) like it is a high maintenance piece of weaponry.
_____________________________
This is our new kitty and we have a new cat who must be so fat I can't crop a picture of him to fit my CW Avatar. His name is Tom Riddle. This little guy here I found in the yard in May, this is Cosmo.
--Roger--
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RE: War in Afghanistan - 10/13/2009 7:29:28 AM
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rlj
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I read the AP version of the M4 article in the paper last night and it has me thinking:
1) Is the terrain and conditions in Afghanistan actually worse than Iraq? Wouldn't all of that sand and heat from the desert have exposed problems with the gun overheating?
2) Could it be a problem with the ammo and/or magazines?
3) Could there simply have been a bad lot of guns made and the soldiers in that particular battle gotten a few of them?
It seems to me if there were problems with the M4 after all of the use it has gotten this decade it would have been obvious before 2008.
Just my thoughts, I don't know guns let alone the ones used in the military.
_____________________________
This is our new kitty and we have a new cat who must be so fat I can't crop a picture of him to fit my CW Avatar. His name is Tom Riddle. This little guy here I found in the yard in May, this is Cosmo.
--Roger--
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RE: War in Afghanistan - 10/19/2009 12:02:54 PM
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cow451
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Harvie
76 DAYS SINCE REQUEST FOR MORE TROOPS, OBAMA ACCUSED OF STALLING
(excerpt)
IN Afghanistan they would call it a shura, the traditional tribal way of listening to elders’ views before reaching a consensus. In Washington, where President Barack Obama has now held five war councils, they are starting to call it dithering.
With another council on the Afghan war scheduled for this week, US officials admit it could be November before a decision is finally taken on whether to agree to General Stanley McChrystal’s request for more troops. One participant revealed that the protagonists have not yet discussed troop numbers.
Latest polls show a majority of Americans now disapprove of Obama’s handling of a war which may come to define his presidency. Many senior members of his own party are in open revolt.
It was unclear, however, whether the Afghan-led Independent Election Commission would accept the findings of the fraud panel and announce a runoff. Karzai's spokesman said it was too soon to make a judgment based on the figures released by the panel.That could mean a further delay in forming a new government that the U.S. believes is needed to help combat the growing Taliban insurgency. A protracted crisis could also lead to political unrest.The White House has also said no decision on sending more U.S. troops to Afghanistan would be made before the election crisis is resolved — a stance reiterated by the civilian chief of the NATO military alliance on Monday.
Call it what you will, but what good will 40,000 more troops do if the central government is so corrupt as to unable to garner the support of most Afghans? One reason the US failed in Viet Nam was the inability of the South Vietnamese to govern themselves.
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Re:the phrase "Under God" in the Pledge of Allegiance?
Sarah Palin: If it was good enough for the founding fathers, its good enough for me and I’ll fight in defense of our Pledge of Allegiance.
("under God" added in 1956.)
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RE: War in Afghanistan - 10/19/2009 3:37:32 PM
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rlj
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quote:
Call it what you will, but what good will 40,000 more troops do if the central government is so corrupt as to unable to garner the support of most Afghans? One reason the US failed in Viet Nam was the inability of the South Vietnamese to govern themselves.
Honestly, based on my ignorance of both Iraq and Afghanistan I thought it would be Iraq that was going to be unable to govern itself and Afghanistan that would be ok. I guess I was wrong. It doesn't change that fact though that some people really don't want democracy even when they don't ask for it, do nothing for it, and have it handed to them on a silver platter.
_____________________________
This is our new kitty and we have a new cat who must be so fat I can't crop a picture of him to fit my CW Avatar. His name is Tom Riddle. This little guy here I found in the yard in May, this is Cosmo.
--Roger--
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RE: War in Afghanistan - 10/19/2009 6:30:17 PM
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huangshan
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quote:
ORIGINAL: rlj
quote:
Call it what you will, but what good will 40,000 more troops do if the central government is so corrupt as to unable to garner the support of most Afghans? One reason the US failed in Viet Nam was the inability of the South Vietnamese to govern themselves.
Honestly, based on my ignorance of both Iraq and Afghanistan I thought it would be Iraq that was going to be unable to govern itself and Afghanistan that would be ok. I guess I was wrong. It doesn't change that fact though that some people really don't want democracy even when they don't ask for it, do nothing for it, and have it handed to them on a silver platter.
Is it really that they don't want it, or is it that instability and corruption poison the well?
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RE: War in Afghanistan - 10/19/2009 6:56:39 PM
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rlj
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quote:
Is it really that they don't want it, or is it that instability and corruption poison the well?
I think that is a part of it. I also think that we aren't dealing with a western mindset, values, and mores. The idea of life, liberty, freedom, and most importantly what that means and how to achieve it are different in that part of the world compared to this part of the world.
_____________________________
This is our new kitty and we have a new cat who must be so fat I can't crop a picture of him to fit my CW Avatar. His name is Tom Riddle. This little guy here I found in the yard in May, this is Cosmo.
--Roger--
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RE: War in Afghanistan - 11/1/2009 7:06:19 AM
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leftwing
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The taliban sux but are we supposed to be there, or anywhere to prevent (or try and cure) the worlds evils? No one has ever conquered Afghanistan though many have tried. I fear we are the next to fail.. and what if we do 'win' in Afgh. like we 'won' in Iraq? Nothing changes 15000 miles away.. we can't be there forever to make sure .. what are we supposed to make sure of?
Those people over there need to rise up and do something on their own. It is our fight to whip the chumps that were behind the attack on 9/11 and that is all.
Maybe we should come home. 
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RE: War in Afghanistan - 11/3/2009 2:20:39 PM
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wing2000
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From: ...the beautiful Sonoran Desert
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quote:
It is our fight to whip the chumps that were behind the attack on 9/11 and that is all.
...and just the other day, the Pakistani Army found travel documents from those inolved with 9/11. If only we had cleared out Afghanistan AND North/Western Pakistan back in 2002....we justifiably could have gone after Al Qaeada in the name of self defense.
...instead, we allowed the Taliban and Al Qaeda to set up shop across the border....while we sen over half of our combat forces to far off Iraq.
< Message edited by wing2000 -- 11/3/2009 2:29:22 PM >
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RE: War in Afghanistan - 11/4/2009 12:46:53 PM
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mapachito13
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quote:
ORIGINAL: John_O
The very first thing to remember is that the war on terrorism is a religious war. It is Christianity against islam. The only way it will ever end is with the death of the last moslem as they are commanded by their scriptures to fight us till the end.
The ONLY way to win is to follow Ann Coulter's advice. Conquer their countries, kill their leaders and convert them to Christianity.
I am just jumping back into the CE folder so please forgive me for dredging up a very old post in this thread but I couldn't go on without responding
What would make Christians any different that the Taliban if we prescribed to this ditzy lady's advice? Answer: Not a darn thing.
It is possible to create good relations with Islamic countries. The proof is in many countries we have good realtions with (e.g., Egypt, Morrocco, Qatar, etc.) but until we live by, and treat other people by, the same standards WE expect to be treated with and truly value the beliefs we espouse to the rest of the world, we will be hated as hypocrites and liars.
I thought that Afghanistan and Sudan were the countries to go to war against after 9/11 but, alas, they do not have as much oil as Iraq. It seems that we are repeating the same mistakes as in Vietnam all over again.
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Moderates are those who know how to use their critical thinking skills.
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RE: War in Afghanistan - 11/6/2009 2:36:48 PM
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wing2000
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"Sadly the government of Afghanistan had become a byword for corruption and I'm not prepared to put the lives of British men and women in harm's way for a government that does not stand up against corruption,"
-British PM Gordon Brown
Five British troops were fatally shot this past week by an Afghan policemen whom they were trianing.
http://www.voanews.com/english/2009-11-06-voa37.cfm
< Message edited by wing2000 -- 11/6/2009 2:44:32 PM >
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RE: War in Afghanistan - 11/8/2009 7:10:30 AM
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rlj
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It is estimated that 99% of Afghanis are Muslims. If Islam is a religion of hatred and violence that is in direct opposite of what we believe in the western world, what is the point of Operation Enduring Freedom when the population of Afghanistan just wants to kill, imprison, etc?
If the hard line critics of Islam are correct, why did they even support this war in the first place as a way of bringing about "freedom"?
_____________________________
This is our new kitty and we have a new cat who must be so fat I can't crop a picture of him to fit my CW Avatar. His name is Tom Riddle. This little guy here I found in the yard in May, this is Cosmo.
--Roger--
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Is Afghanistan still a just war? - 11/12/2009 8:15:29 PM
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Fritzpw_Admin
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quote:
Afghanistan: The Weighty Decision of Just War
Chuck Colson - BreakPoint
The President is under great pressure regarding Afghanistan. Top military commanders on the ground and conservatives in Congress want more troops—and fast. Liberal members of the President's own party are dead set against that—some would like to leave Afghanistan altogether.
And people are irritated with the President for taking so long to decide. Now, I don't agree often with the President's policies, but I have great sympathy for him here—because the moral implications of his decision are staggering. I would not want to be in his shoes.
What the President must examine is this: whether our cause and goals are just. And the answer no longer seems crystal clear.
For nearly two millennia, Christian thinkers starting with Augustine, joined by many Muslim intellectuals, have developed what is known as the just war theory. For a war to be seen as just, it must meet several conditions. It must be waged by legitimate authority. The cause itself must be just, as well as the intention behind going to war. War must be a last resort, waged by means proportional to the threat. We must not target non-combatants, and we must have a reasonable chance of success.
Read the rest of Afghanistan: The Weighty Decision of Just War
Some excellent commentary here from Chuck Colson.
What do you think? Is Afghanistan still a just war?
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RE: Is Afghanistan still a just war? - 11/13/2009 2:25:47 PM
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mapachito13
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I always thought Afghanistan was where we should have sent the bulk of our troops to begin with after 9/11. They had the Taliban who was harboring Al-Qaeda and Osama was there. Instead of just sending a token force to help the Northern Alliance to overthrow the Taliban, I think they could have sent the forces there instead of Iraq.
The terrain has proven that more troops on the ground was and is needed there. I do believe the war in this country was severely mismanaged. Could we have captured Osama with the extra troops? Who knows, but at least we could claim we put forth a first rate effort.
Sudan was the other country that showed a fondness for Al-Qaeda. If there was to be a second front, there is where it should have been IMO.
_____________________________
Peace Sells....But Who's Buying!
"Freedom comes with an educated mind." - Jacqueline Rushing
Moderates are those who know how to use their critical thinking skills.
I could be illegal! Lev. 19:33-34
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RE: Is Afghanistan still a just war? - 11/13/2009 3:18:32 PM
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wing2000
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Fritzpw_Admin
quote:
Afghanistan: The Weighty Decision of Just War
Chuck Colson - BreakPoint
The President is under great pressure regarding Afghanistan. Top military commanders on the ground and conservatives in Congress want more troops—and fast. Liberal members of the President's own party are dead set against that—some would like to leave Afghanistan altogether.
And people are irritated with the President for taking so long to decide. Now, I don't agree often with the President's policies, but I have great sympathy for him here—because the moral implications of his decision are staggering. I would not want to be in his shoes.
What the President must examine is this: whether our cause and goals are just. And the answer no longer seems crystal clear.
For nearly two millennia, Christian thinkers starting with Augustine, joined by many Muslim intellectuals, have developed what is known as the just war theory. For a war to be seen as just, it must meet several conditions. It must be waged by legitimate authority. The cause itself must be just, as well as the intention behind going to war. War must be a last resort, waged by means proportional to the threat. We must not target non-combatants, and we must have a reasonable chance of success.
Read the rest of Afghanistan: The Weighty Decision of Just War
Some excellent commentary here from Chuck Colson.
What do you think? Is Afghanistan still a just war?
Agreed...excellent article by Chuck Colson.
I need to give it some more thought as to whether the war meets the requirements of a Just War....today.
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RE: Is Afghanistan still a just war? - 11/13/2009 4:43:27 PM
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rlj
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I think Chuck did an excellent job of describing the problems in Afghanistan and pointing out there is no easy answer.
Where I disagreed with him is on his subject of just and unjust war. There are two sides of every story (or more) and deciding whether a war is just or unjust really depends on which side you are on and a myriad of circumstances. He also tries to make it look as if the method of modern war has been accepted for centuries in his "just war" thesis. While the idea is good it has only been accepted since the last half of the 20th century. Civilians were targeted in both great wars and our Civil war for example.
_____________________________
This is our new kitty and we have a new cat who must be so fat I can't crop a picture of him to fit my CW Avatar. His name is Tom Riddle. This little guy here I found in the yard in May, this is Cosmo.
--Roger--
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RE: Is Afghanistan still a just war? - 11/13/2009 5:52:16 PM
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tafkam
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quote:
I always thought Afghanistan was where we should have sent the bulk of our troops to begin with after 9/11. They had the Taliban who was harboring Al-Qaeda and Osama was there. Instead of just sending a token force to help the Northern Alliance to overthrow the Taliban, I think they could have sent the forces there instead of Iraq.
You're not gonna believe this, but I agree with you. While I did believe that Saddam needed to be dealt with, I seriously questioned putting them second in line behind Afghanistan, and then committing before things had been solidly accomplished there.
I would have placed North Korea or Iran on much higher priority than Iraq....but then that's just me.....
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Tafkam
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